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Against Me!'s Tom Gabel Comes Out as Transgender


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Beth and Casey, simple question: Do you hold any prejudices in your life? I assume that you do. Instead of acting like moral policeman on a message board, why not address your own personal issues, whatever they may be?

 

I respect that you guys are trying to be champions of equality, as a libertarian leaning person, I am on the same page. But there is a line between championing rights and pompously policing the morality of someone you don't even know. Do I need to take a lie detector test for you so that I can prove I'm not holding deep-seeded prejudice?

 

I have apologized for taking old beef into a personal problem thread and my apology was accepted. By continuing to question my "implicit/explicit prejudices" you yourselves are acting prejudice. The problem has been addressed personally between both of us, yet you continue to pry.

 

I get where you're coming from.  I know the stereotypical liberal douches that you seem to attach me and Beth to (like in South Park with the smug alert episode, or the memes that float around on Reddit, can't remember the name, it's the pic of the girl with dread locks).  

 

Of course everyone holds prejudices at some point in their lives, but there is a huge difference on who/why/what they are based on.  If discrimination is based on something that is innate and uncontrollable for a person (race, sex, sexual orientation, etc.), then it's totally unacceptable IMO.  It doesn't make you pompous for standing up against ignorant people that discriminate people based on these categories, so I'm not sure what you're getting at there.

 

I'm not acting like a moral policeman on a message board.  I'm expressing my view and pointing out why I believe you originally used flawed reasoning on the matter (Rabbyt being trans was the result of a chain of other personal choices, when in reality, they are completely unrelated).  It's a public message board; if you don't like having your posts scrutinized, don't post if you can't handle it, otherwise man up and stop throwing out shitty generalizations and posts that have nothing to do with the original issue at hand. 

And I didn't continue to pry, you JUST mentioned me and Beth in a recent post.  I'm happy you guys kissed and made up, but I'm not the person that just stirred shit up. 

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Wow, someone else who thought their riveting views on gender were worth repeating less than a year later.   Also, if you have shit for brains, it doesn't matter how smart you think you are or how

Glad to see that your perspective has evolved.

I wasn't here for that discussion, but I think there's a big difference between speculating about a famous musician's reasons for transitioning (someone who will probably never read what you wrote) an

If I'm guilty of something here, it's of being a judgmental person. I am not uncomfortable, implicitly or explicitly, with transgendered people. I may think some of them are mentally unstable, but I think that about a lot of other people with no known sexual identity issues.


 


And I read the first half of your post with respect Casey. Then you drop the "man up" line (which could spark an entire other debate along the same lines, btw) and you end your post by pointing your finger right back at me. It's a never ending battle. That is why I tend to disappear from discussions like this. It gets old! This shit is for oliver. I get bored with it fast. If I'm going to get into heated discussions, I want it to be full of niku style drama, not formal debates that drag on endlessly.


 


we've got along well in the past, I don't see why there needs to be any kind of on-going feud here.


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[facepalm]


 


This is nit picking as far as I'm concerned...and pronouns, ungroovy, pronouns!!  I thought what Ghent said was enough to drop the subject.  I thought what he said was pretty dope considering our history.  That meant a lot.  Doesn't make us best friends but at least we can respectfully shake hands and call it a day.  I thank you ungroovy and shrugging man (still don't remember your name!) for your support, but all I want now is for anything about what happened regarding me to be over.


 


 


So on the subject of Laura, has she gone through SRS?  That's one thing that both excites and terrifies me.  I so don't want to be a statistic but I'm so amazed at the progress this surgery has gained.  Self lube!  Are you kidding me?  Thats in tents.


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It isn't really about you in particular, I spoke pretty generally with some reference to your specific story.  I've been put down as a person not worthy of intellectual conversation in a flippant remark that I don't appreciate, so I'll defend myself, and my points.  That's all.


 


I won't discuss this anymore, if it makes you uncomfortable, but I'm doing my best not to speak for you, and mostly speak for myself.  The situation was obnoxious for more reasons than one.


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I said I didn't like getting into never ending debates with people like you. You invented the part about me thinking I'm too smart to have a debate with you or whatever. Maybe im not smart enough? Doesn't really matter. It's just tiring. And it continues..

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It isn't really about you in particular, I spoke pretty generally with some reference to your specific story.  I've been put down as a person not worthy of intellectual conversation in a flippant remark that I don't appreciate, so I'll defend myself, and my points.  That's all.

 

I won't discuss this anymore, if it makes you uncomfortable, but I'm doing my best not to speak for you, and mostly speak for myself.  The situation was obnoxious for more reasons than one.

 

Im in a much better place now.  If you have a beef then by all means go for it.  Just throwing my 2 cents in.  I understand your not directly talking about me.  Don't worry about it, just worry about pronouns ;) 

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No worries ;)  it happens.  You should see what happens when my friends and my boss get together.  Boss calls me he and my birth name and friends call me she and my new name.  So ridiculous.  The looks on everyone's faces as the day goes on is priceless.


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This is a complex issue because it bases on whether people believe in the physical aspect of the body or the emotional, I think it is disrespectful to refer to someone as the opposite gender that they represent as, but it's also wrong in my opinion to force someone to use language they are not comfortable with, if someone sees every person born as their physical sex it will be hard to use a language that differs from this and I don't think forcing them to use the gender-pronouns the individual is representing is a good idea for either parts. I do think it's bad when someone uses the physical sex pronouns and also saying something hateful though that's when it gets closer to bigotry for me, but this is also a psychological reaction from what the person using sees as the political correct forcing language on them.


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The pronouns have nothing to do with whether or not it makes the speaker a little uncomfortable.  I get tripped up, because I don't know many people in the same situation, but there's a specific vocabulary that she's requested and I will do my best to stay with it because it isn't a choice.


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If I'm guilty of something here, it's of being a judgmental person. I am not uncomfortable, implicitly or explicitly, with transgendered people. I may think some of them are mentally unstable, but I think that about a lot of other people with no known sexual identity issues.

 

And I read the first half of your post with respect Casey. Then you drop the "man up" line (which could spark an entire other debate along the same lines, btw) and you end your post by pointing your finger right back at me. It's a never ending battle. That is why I tend to disappear from discussions like this. It gets old! This shit is for oliver. I get bored with it fast. If I'm going to get into heated discussions, I want it to be full of niku style drama, not formal debates that drag on endlessly.

 

we've got along well in the past, I don't see why there needs to be any kind of on-going feud here.

 

 

awww, i knew you secretly loved me. 

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